Are international critics of Russia's claim on the Arctic merely jealous?


Norman 30 October, 2007, 22:35	There has always been a scientific interest in the Arctic and Antartica. Now that oil and other natural resources have been discovered there, every nation wants a part of it. The polar regions are also an important indicator of the progress of GLOBAL WARMING. I hope mankind doesn't ruin this part of the world too. permalink quote 0 Norman
MihalMihalich 31 October, 2007, 01:51	Dear Ladies & Gentlemen Let me start with flag at North Pole, it was proof that we actually went there, and took samples. 100% Proof. Only way to prove that the underwater area Russia claims to be part of its Plateau is to drill thousands meters deep under thousands matters of water, and not just in one place, but all the way through. It is simply unthinkable & unreasonable. Cost of that proof would outweigh profits. If Russians are smart enough they will not accept any demands for further research & get many great layers to settle this matter legally. I think Russians have chance to prove it IF they do it fast, before it will become political issue, because politics change rules. Best Regards permalink quote 0 MihalMihalich
Claimed 31 October, 2007, 07:35	It's basically an open and shut case! The Russians went under the pole, planted a flag, conducted surveys and now claim to have the evidence to back up their claims as per the UN Laws. If this isn't legal, I don't know what is? HOWEVER, with the various unsubstantiated claims on various unclaimed parts of the earth's anatomy flying thick and fast, this legal claim could get embroiled in a war of words and MORE, if not settled fast. After all, the war on Iraqi people started W/O any UN Resolutions. permalink quote 0 Claimed
James 13 March, 2008, 07:01	Oil exploration from the North Sea and the Mexican Gulf takes place in the international waters and there are no intentional agreements based on which only Britain, Norway, US and Mexico can claim to be the only explorers there. Nothing should stop Russia or any other country to set up drilling platforms in the international waters of the North Sea. In view of that Russia should do what it feels fit with respect to Arctic mineral resources. permalink quote 0 James
Sam 13 March, 2008, 07:41	Many people seem to think that the basis of Russian claim on the artic is the flag that was planted there. That is not what the Claim is about.It is about claiming that the artic is part of the continental shelf of Eurasia and therefore extension of Russia's territory. Here I am not clear on the milage a country has right to claim exclusive mining rights. If Scientists can conclusively prove them correct then do not think it would cause any disputes.Same applies if It is proven that the artic is part of american continent and Canada can make a claim based on international law. permalink quote 0 Sam
Vijay 13 March, 2008, 09:41	The whole EU paper is a bag full of horse sh**! It's time for EU in general and the "Old Europe" in particular to do some introspection- Whether it 'really' represents the European continent or is merely an extension of an American Neo-Con agenda? Whether it is the same body, that began as EEC comprising of 13 members,trying to bring about an economic integration or mis-evolved into a purely Geo-political body involving more than a 20 members.with the intention of becoming a COUNTRY? Europe is a part of the greater "Eurasian' landmass, sharing the same physical space stretching from Japan in the east to the beaches of Normandy in the west. The 'west' is across the channel and much farther across the Atlantic. The 'east' is a mental attitude. Europe today, stands, if it chooses to be so, between the resurgent/rising 'east' led by India, Russia, China, ASEAN and still to some extent a technically strong Japan AND the 'west' for whatever it represents. Europe's best chance in this fast changing world is to make this 'correct' decision or become irrelevant in the 'near'future - with its falling population, falling growth rates, its draconian investment/climate control laws etc etc. It either risks becoming a continent of hundred 'Kosovos' or becoming a bridge between the 'east' and the 'west', where both shall have a stake in its future and security. If Europe wants to indulge in suicide - the way is open and easy, the reverse is probably harder! And Arctic, Antartic, the Oceans, the space et all are governed by Laws or by the absence of them. And if war is the only solution, so be it.!! permalink quote 0 Vijay
John 13 March, 2008, 21:53	I think jealous is the wrong word, the phrase "bad loosers" is more appropriate. permalink quote 0 John
Norman 14 March, 2008, 00:18	Just like in the Cold War days, let Russia and the United States divide the Arctic! permalink quote 0 Norman
Dan 14 March, 2008, 04:49	Everyone keeps talking about the flag being planted as the starting basis for a solid debate. Does that mean America can now lay claim to the Moon? As an Australian of Russian ancestry I can honestly say I am completely impartial to this issue, but if real debate is to be had then let's base it on solid scientific evidence, not esoteric symbolism. And a little commonsense never hurt either. War is the most awful thing a person can ever experience. Russia and the EU in particular should never forget the lessons of their bloody past. If it wasn’t for this bloody history I would probably be writing this message in Russian. permalink quote 0 Dan
Dan 14 March, 2008, 05:02	Oh and Vijay, You want war so bad? Really? I highly doubt it. Will you join up? I highly doubt it. Will you want you son or grandson to join up and sacrifice their life for some gas and oil? I highly doubt it. I’m reminded of something a US marine once said while serving his third tour in Iraq. He said he would gladly do a fourth if Bush came and rode next to him. People like you rattle the saber but are never willing to put themselves in front of it (from memory Bush's father had the young president posted to a cushy national guard role during the Vietnam war. figures.) Leave the politics to people who are not so emotionally volatile, your sons and grandsons will thank you for it. permalink quote 0 Dan
Vijay 14 March, 2008, 07:04	Dan says - Oh and Vijay, You want war so bad? Really? I highly doubt it. Will you join up? I highly doubt it. Will you want you son or grandson to join up and sacrifice their life for some gas and oil? Response - That's the whole point I'm making! The EU recommendations point to energy security and the right to protect them. May I ask on whose behalf and to whose detriment? Is a country's right to develop it's own natural resources with or W/O the help of others also on hold/should be compromised according to some Neo-Con agenda? That's the whole point I'm making, does EU in particular and others in general gain or lose by cooperating with countries who have those resources and are willing to share them for the general good of mankind. For will anytime natural resources ever go out of fashion/not needed? Probably for those that believe in the "Global Warming Hoax" perhaps. permalink quote 0 Vijay
ROBERT (U.S.) 26 March, 2008, 05:34	Its sounds to me to be a never ending controversy. If the Arctic is so great why does Russia have to fish in U.S. Territorial Waters.When I used to be in fisheries patrol on the aleutian chain. We used to have to board Russian fishing vessels and inspect for contraband fish. Of course the Russians would allways brib us with a party and lots of good looking women and lots of Vodka.Of course that was the old Russia.Then the Russian women would allways try to teach me survival Russian (Drink Commrad)(Drink Commrad ).Every Russian sailor wanted us to drink from his own personal bottle of vodka. And smoke those funny Russian ciggarrets.I tell you I used to love to board those Russian fishing boats back in the old days. permalink quote 0 ROBERT (U.S.)
Sam 27 March, 2008, 07:11	Robert(US) it is nice to hear a honest person who admits to taking bribs. That Russian fishing fleet most have been some party ship complete with pretty girls:) However you have completely lost the whole plot of the affair,You really have no idea of what it is all about. permalink quote 0 Sam
Sam 3 May, 2008, 17:33	People its not that Russia is trying to claim the artic because it planted its flag. But rather its argument on geological basis. If the artic is joined with the continental Russian plate then they have an argument okay. Stop the fuss and accept the reality. permalink quote 0 Sam
Ahmed Ojullah 4 May, 2008, 13:31	Putting a flag at the bottom of the Artic is good and a pride to Russia. Why are some bias people and states too negative about Russia? They portray anything about Russia as bad but the same thing is praised when done by another ally of theirs.This must stop. We need no unipolar world power any more. Russia must rise again to balance isuses affecting the world today. Unipolar has led us to countless authoritarian wars. I personally like the way Russia is doing things around the world. Unlike the USA, Russia tries to maintain peace and at least avoid arm conflict as a way of resolving global issues. We are tied of rumours of wars. permalink quote 0 Ahmed Ojullah
oleg 11 May, 2008, 04:52	The Arctic should be an internationl zone. No nation has a right to claim it. All this amounts to is greed and power! permalink quote 0 oleg
dan 28 May, 2008, 07:45	I would have thought that Russia would have built a wall around the pole by now with plenty of mines wire and armed patrols like they did in Europe many years ago.Bloody fools all of them.Do they never stop and look at themselves? permalink quote 0 dan
martin 28 May, 2008, 08:58	I hope everyone is aware of the hoax the Russians tried to pull with their underwater achievements - they were scenes from the movie Titanic. Here's a link (or search from google: north pole russia flag finland OR finnish) http://www.hs.fi/english/article/iIlta-Sanomati+reveals+embarrassing+error+in+Reuters+feed+on+Russian+North+Pole+sub+expedition/1135229390631 permalink quote 0 martin
aj 'Mclean' 28 May, 2008, 19:44	Russia deserves claim on north pole and the arctic.they have maximum borders with the arctic lands and have always lived in the vicinity of it . so they rightly deserve exclusive rights for arctic or its natural resources.after proving the ridge underneath it is totally clear that arctic belongs to Russia in the same way as does the Ukraine , Belarus , and other nations broken from it in 1992. permalink quote 0 aj 'Mclean'
Sam 29 May, 2008, 06:30	Really funny martin,did you even read your own link? What has Russia got to do with it? Why are you not blaiming Reuters for it? After all it was them that mixed up the footage. Dan yes why don't the Russians also give up moscow as a good will gesture too. If the north pole is proven to be part of the continental shelf of Euroasia then the international law will give Russia exclusive mining rights to it. Business is business. I wonder if you will come here to call people "bloody fools" if it is shown that it is actually the continental shelf of the americans. Funny how many people show their ignorance by not even finding out what the claim is all about. permalink quote 0 Sam

Norman 30 October, 2007, 22:35

There has always been a scientific interest in the Arctic and Antartica. Now that oil and other natural resources have been discovered there, every nation wants a part of it. The polar regions are also an important indicator of the progress of GLOBAL WARMING. I hope mankind doesn't ruin this part of the world too.

permalink quote Norman

MihalMihalich 31 October, 2007, 01:51

Dear Ladies & Gentlemen Let me start with flag at North Pole, it was proof that we actually went there, and took samples. 100% Proof. Only way to prove that the underwater area Russia claims to be part of its Plateau is to drill thousands meters deep under thousands matters of water, and not just in one place, but all the way through. It is simply unthinkable & unreasonable. Cost of that proof would outweigh profits. If Russians are smart enough they will not accept any demands for further research & get many great layers to settle this matter legally. I think Russians have chance to prove it IF they do it fast, before it will become political issue, because politics change rules. Best Regards

permalink quote MihalMihalich

Claimed 31 October, 2007, 07:35

It's basically an open and shut case! The Russians went under the pole, planted a flag, conducted surveys and now claim to have the evidence to back up their claims as per the UN Laws. If this isn't legal, I don't know what is? HOWEVER, with the various unsubstantiated claims on various unclaimed parts of the earth's anatomy flying thick and fast, this legal claim could get embroiled in a war of words and MORE, if not settled fast. After all, the war on Iraqi people started W/O any UN Resolutions.

permalink quote Claimed

James 13 March, 2008, 07:01

Oil exploration from the North Sea and the Mexican Gulf takes place in the international waters and there are no intentional agreements based on which only Britain, Norway, US and Mexico can claim to be the only explorers there. Nothing should stop Russia or any other country to set up drilling platforms in the international waters of the North Sea. In view of that Russia should do what it feels fit with respect to Arctic mineral resources.

permalink quote James

Sam 13 March, 2008, 07:41

Many people seem to think that the basis of Russian claim on the artic is the flag that was planted there. That is not what the Claim is about.It is about claiming that the artic is part of the continental shelf of Eurasia and therefore extension of Russia's territory. Here I am not clear on the milage a country has right to claim exclusive mining rights. If Scientists can conclusively prove them correct then do not think it would cause any disputes.Same applies if It is proven that the artic is part of american continent and Canada can make a claim based on international law.

permalink quote Sam

Vijay 13 March, 2008, 09:41

The whole EU paper is a bag full of horse sh**! It's time for EU in general and the "Old Europe" in particular to do some introspection- Whether it 'really' represents the European continent or is merely an extension of an American Neo-Con agenda? Whether it is the same body, that began as EEC comprising of 13 members,trying to bring about an economic integration or mis-evolved into a purely Geo-political body involving more than a 20 members.with the intention of becoming a COUNTRY? Europe is a part of the greater "Eurasian' landmass, sharing the same physical space stretching from Japan in the east to the beaches of Normandy in the west. The 'west' is across the channel and much farther across the Atlantic. The 'east' is a mental attitude. Europe today, stands, if it chooses to be so, between the resurgent/rising 'east' led by India, Russia, China, ASEAN and still to some extent a technically strong Japan AND the 'west' for whatever it represents. Europe's best chance in this fast changing world is to make this 'correct' decision or become irrelevant in the 'near'future - with its falling population, falling growth rates, its draconian investment/climate control laws etc etc. It either risks becoming a continent of hundred 'Kosovos' or becoming a bridge between the 'east' and the 'west', where both shall have a stake in its future and security. If Europe wants to indulge in suicide - the way is open and easy, the reverse is probably harder! And Arctic, Antartic, the Oceans, the space et all are governed by Laws or by the absence of them. And if war is the only solution, so be it.!!

permalink quote Vijay

John 13 March, 2008, 21:53

I think jealous is the wrong word, the phrase "bad loosers" is more appropriate.

permalink quote John

Norman 14 March, 2008, 00:18

Just like in the Cold War days, let Russia and the United States divide the Arctic!

permalink quote Norman

Dan 14 March, 2008, 04:49

Everyone keeps talking about the flag being planted as the starting basis for a solid debate. Does that mean America can now lay claim to the Moon? As an Australian of Russian ancestry I can honestly say I am completely impartial to this issue, but if real debate is to be had then let's base it on solid scientific evidence, not esoteric symbolism. And a little commonsense never hurt either. War is the most awful thing a person can ever experience. Russia and the EU in particular should never forget the lessons of their bloody past. If it wasn’t for this bloody history I would probably be writing this message in Russian.

permalink quote Dan

Dan 14 March, 2008, 05:02

Oh and Vijay, You want war so bad? Really? I highly doubt it. Will you join up? I highly doubt it. Will you want you son or grandson to join up and sacrifice their life for some gas and oil? I highly doubt it. I’m reminded of something a US marine once said while serving his third tour in Iraq. He said he would gladly do a fourth if Bush came and rode next to him. People like you rattle the saber but are never willing to put themselves in front of it (from memory Bush's father had the young president posted to a cushy national guard role during the Vietnam war. figures.) Leave the politics to people who are not so emotionally volatile, your sons and grandsons will thank you for it.

permalink quote Dan

Vijay 14 March, 2008, 07:04

Dan says - Oh and Vijay, You want war so bad? Really? I highly doubt it. Will you join up? I highly doubt it. Will you want you son or grandson to join up and sacrifice their life for some gas and oil? Response - That's the whole point I'm making! The EU recommendations point to energy security and the right to protect them. May I ask on whose behalf and to whose detriment? Is a country's right to develop it's own natural resources with or W/O the help of others also on hold/should be compromised according to some Neo-Con agenda? That's the whole point I'm making, does EU in particular and others in general gain or lose by cooperating with countries who have those resources and are willing to share them for the general good of mankind. For will anytime natural resources ever go out of fashion/not needed? Probably for those that believe in the "Global Warming Hoax" perhaps.

permalink quote Vijay

ROBERT (U.S.) 26 March, 2008, 05:34

Its sounds to me to be a never ending controversy. If the Arctic is so great why does Russia have to fish in U.S. Territorial Waters.When I used to be in fisheries patrol on the aleutian chain. We used to have to board Russian fishing vessels and inspect for contraband fish. Of course the Russians would allways brib us with a party and lots of good looking women and lots of Vodka.Of course that was the old Russia.Then the Russian women would allways try to teach me survival Russian (Drink Commrad)(Drink Commrad ).Every Russian sailor wanted us to drink from his own personal bottle of vodka. And smoke those funny Russian ciggarrets.I tell you I used to love to board those Russian fishing boats back in the old days.

permalink quote ROBERT (U.S.)

Sam 27 March, 2008, 07:11

Robert(US) it is nice to hear a honest person who admits to taking bribs. That Russian fishing fleet most have been some party ship complete with pretty girls:) However you have completely lost the whole plot of the affair,You really have no idea of what it is all about.

permalink quote Sam

Sam 3 May, 2008, 17:33

People its not that Russia is trying to claim the artic because it planted its flag. But rather its argument on geological basis. If the artic is joined with the continental Russian plate then they have an argument okay. Stop the fuss and accept the reality.

permalink quote Sam

Ahmed Ojullah 4 May, 2008, 13:31

Putting a flag at the bottom of the Artic is good and a pride to Russia. Why are some bias people and states too negative about Russia? They portray anything about Russia as bad but the same thing is praised when done by another ally of theirs.This must stop. We need no unipolar world power any more. Russia must rise again to balance isuses affecting the world today. Unipolar has led us to countless authoritarian wars. I personally like the way Russia is doing things around the world. Unlike the USA, Russia tries to maintain peace and at least avoid arm conflict as a way of resolving global issues. We are tied of rumours of wars.

permalink quote Ahmed Ojullah

oleg 11 May, 2008, 04:52

The Arctic should be an internationl zone. No nation has a right to claim it. All this amounts to is greed and power!

permalink quote oleg

dan 28 May, 2008, 07:45

I would have thought that Russia would have built a wall around the pole by now with plenty of mines wire and armed patrols like they did in Europe many years ago.Bloody fools all of them.Do they never stop and look at themselves?

permalink quote dan

martin 28 May, 2008, 08:58

I hope everyone is aware of the hoax the Russians tried to pull with their underwater achievements - they were scenes from the movie Titanic. Here's a link (or search from google: north pole russia flag finland OR finnish) http://www.hs.fi/english/article/iIlta-Sanomati+reveals+embarrassing+error+in+Reuters+feed+on+Russian+North+Pole+sub+expedition/1135229390631

permalink quote martin

aj 'Mclean' 28 May, 2008, 19:44

Russia deserves claim on north pole and the arctic.they have maximum borders with the arctic lands and have always lived in the vicinity of it . so they rightly deserve exclusive rights for arctic or its natural resources.after proving the ridge underneath it is totally clear that arctic belongs to Russia in the same way as does the Ukraine , Belarus , and other nations broken from it in 1992.

permalink quote aj 'Mclean'

Sam 29 May, 2008, 06:30

Really funny martin,did you even read your own link? What has Russia got to do with it? Why are you not blaiming Reuters for it? After all it was them that mixed up the footage. Dan yes why don't the Russians also give up moscow as a good will gesture too. If the north pole is proven to be part of the continental shelf of Euroasia then the international law will give Russia exclusive mining rights to it. Business is business. I wonder if you will come here to call people "bloody fools" if it is shown that it is actually the continental shelf of the americans. Funny how many people show their ignorance by not even finding out what the claim is all about.

permalink quote Sam

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