U.S. antimissiles in Europe: a safer world or a new arms race?, page 13


mike 18 August, 2008, 12:05	this is international corporations making a killing again, what purpose to plant missiles in poland i'm sure any sub or ship can be deployed with these missiles. cold war, just another fear tactic to spend more on both sides,, russia couldn't pawn of their equipment fast enough, now it wants to rearm please . that goes for the usa, why . because the military industrial complex wants to rape the citizens of the world. hmm,,,, usa, was pissed that russia was arming cuba,, i can understand why russia would be concerned with missiles in poland. iran my arse. total bullshit. on the other hand we usa/russia trade like nothing is going on. putin/bush greet each other like brothers at the olympics. what morons, but they laughing all the way to the bank.and the citizens are paying. permalink quote 0 mike
David 18 August, 2008, 18:02	Hi Robert; When USA posed this mad idea of placing missiles in the old USSR countries i.e. along Russia's border, Russia did approach USA to be part of the scheme - missiles against those fired from 'rogue states'. Russia offered the use of its tracking facilities whilst USA supplied the missiles. USA refused this offer from Russia. Refused this hand of friendship and continued co-operation. This refusal, by USA, has been a clear indication that, unless proven otherwise, the only 'rogue' country that USA is talking about is Russia. USA, using the cloak of NATO, is wanting to build a missile shield, against, Russia, for its purpose, on European soil. The USA has got no intention of creating a partnership with Russia to help build a safer world. Taking this a little further, Russia had complied with all requests made regarding the building of the Nuclar plant in Iran to prevent Iran from building 'the bomb'. And these requests (pressure) from the USA. The USA still thinks of Reds Under the Beds, and the Russians will your babies and all that clap trap. The media doesn't help any with their lies. If there was less hipocryts/liars as politicians I am sure we will live in a better world. Am sure you have heard of: There are lies, lies and statistics. Well you can politicians to the end of that statement. permalink quote 0 David
Eric 18 August, 2008, 23:22	Like most Americans, I have no idea what ten interceptor missles will accomplish against the vast array of ICBMs that Russia still has in its arsenel. I think the Bush administration ( reelected through the strategic plotting of Carl Rove -placing referendums on gay marriage on as many state ballots as possible- ) is rewarding Poland for playing along in Iraq. This is hardly any reward that I would appreciate. I hope that cooler heads prevail and all this foolish posturing stops. permalink quote 0 Eric
Pharago 19 August, 2008, 07:54	damn it, lets hope usa elections comes fast and the madman that lives in the white house gets kicked in his presidential ass for good, hes going to blow up european arms balance, missile shield? in poland? in poland? c'mon u've got to be kidding me, why not in israel? or egypt? or some place where it makes sense? anyone really belives that a missile flying from iran will cross the damn mediterranean sea? im telling you that man in the white house is an idiot that thinks that the rest of the world is as stupid as him, what a waste of resources. permalink quote 0 Pharago
panther 19 August, 2008, 10:34	The first post-Cold War expansion of NATO came with the reunification of Germany on 3 October 1990, when the former East Germany became part of the Federal Republic of Germany and the alliance. This had been agreed in the Two Plus Four Treaty earlier in the year. To secure Soviet approval of a united Germany remaining in NATO, it was agreed that foreign troops and nuclear weapons would not be stationed in the east. The scholar Stephen F. Cohen argued in 2005 that a commitment was given that NATO would never expand further east, but according to Robert B. Zoellick, then a State Department official involved in the Two Plus Four negotiating process, this appears to be a misperception; no formal commitment of the sort was made. On May 7, 2008, The Daily Telegraph held an interview with Gorbachev in which he repeated his view that such a commitment had been made. Gorbachev said "the Americans promised that NATO wouldn't move beyond the boundaries of Germany after the Cold War but now half of central and eastern Europe are members, so what happened to their promises? It shows they cannot be trusted." In April 2007, NATO's European allies called for a NATO missile defence system which would complement the American National Missile Defense system to protect Europe from missile attacks and NATO's decision-making. Russian president Vladimir Putin claimed that such a deployment could lead to a new arms race and could enhance the likelihood of mutual destruction. He also suggested that his country would freeze its compliance with the 1990 Treaty on Conventional Armed Forces in Europe (CFE)—which limits military deployments across the continent—until all NATO countries had ratified the adapted CFE treaty. NATO members wanted Russia to include a withdrawal of its forces in Georgia. The linkage between the ratification of the adapted treaty and the complete withdrawal has no legal basis, but is rather a political decision made by NATO members. After Russia was not willing to support the US missile defense plans in Europe, Putin threatened a "moratorium" on the treaty in his April 26, 2007 address. Putin later issued a decree intended to suspend the observance of its treaty obligations on July 14, 2007, effective 150 days later which means Russia is now entitled to enter into an "arms race". Russia's military spending last year was [ declared ] as $40 billion and it 'declared' a further [ $200 billion ] spending plan to "upgrade its armaments and military". permalink quote 0 panther
Arina 19 August, 2008, 10:45	Bob: Iran is bad now because they supply weapon to Terrorist? How about US gave all kind of money and weapon in 80's to Taliban and gave birth to Osama, US only gave all Chemcal weapon to Saddam to use against Iran, SO US only Harbor terrorist again Russia and Iran and now when Iran is doing same thing, US dont like it? Sure, so whatever US does is alway LEGAL and whatever the rest of the world does is always Illegal? Talk about INVADING Iran, (We the USA should just do it ourself, and Invade Iran) Yeah sure, GO TRY IT, or first Finish your Iraq and Afghanistan Invasion then try Iran or you would never end it in 50 years (unlike Iraq and Afghanistan is going on 8th year now) 50 years or more will take to Invade Iran, just like Israel trying Palestine for 60 years now. Now invasion is the defination what you mean by Invade, unlike Stupid bush said "Mission Accounplished" STILL NOT YET. permalink quote +1 Arina
Walter 19 August, 2008, 19:42	The Russian concern over anti missile bases in Poland for the defense of Europe against possible attacks from missiles fired from the middle East is totally unfounded. The scope of this missile is hardly large enough to protect Europe from the large number of Russian missiles still targeted on the West. It seems to me that Comrade Putin has once again succumbed to the centuries old Russian paranoia of the west has returned to the world stage. Now that he has the financial backing from the sale of oil and gas I think we will see him try to re-erect the Iron Curtain and pull as many of the former Republics in with him. With this in mind, the placement of US anti-missiles will be an absolute necessity and unfortunately lead to a renewal of the arms race. permalink quote -1 Walter
Neutral 19 August, 2008, 20:40	What are the range of these so called rogue state's missiles?Why is the proposed missile defence shield nescessary in Poland or is that relevant to the trajectory nescessary for interception? We all know the only real winners in any arms race is the guy who runs the production line but that's nothing new. The funny thing is that if you locked some honest level headed openminded forward thinking US citizens into the same building with some similiarly minded Russian citizens and left them there for a whole day they would probably exit that very room as the best of friends whereas if you locked just a group of Polish citizens into that building on their own they would probably start fighting with each other. The thing is the ordinary man on the street who has any reasonable intellect or wisdom on world matters knows damn well that it's mainly a race to secure resources and stability in the regions these resources come from and the dice has already been thrown. Back to the missile defence shield.It won't work without Russian cooperation.Let's be reasonable.would you allow it on your borders without proper consultation and cooperation.After all it would surely be passing over your airspace to hit these rouge state's missiles eh?? We need to stop the monopoly mentality and realise that EVERYONE on this earth needs a safe free clean earth and spend a little more time regulating the private corporations who are profiting from our planet's resources and its inhabitants quarrels. permalink quote 0 Neutral
tlumacz 21 August, 2008, 10:07	The recent decision of Polish authorities to allow placing U.S. antimissiles in Poland is highly unpopular. It is against public opinion. Therefore, a spontanous demonstration SOLIDARITY WITH RUSSIA has been scheduled in front of of Russian Embassy in Poland, Warsaw, 49 Belwederska Street, on Friday, August 22nd, at 5 p.m. Polish time. permalink quote +1 tlumacz
sam 25 August, 2010, 23:06	17 August, 2008, 14:07, Dolly wrote > yes the same Alqeida that the Americans created and funded. Saddam Hussein used to be a CIA agent. I don't think America are in a position to give morality lessons. They are tyrants, who support the brutal Zionist government of Israel. Well done Russia for not letting America walk all over you; I couldn't explain better, as they did similarly toppling Iranian Democratic government ( Dr Mossadeg ) , then toppled the Late Shah, creating so called green Band as Islam , to prevent oil rich Middle-East , of invasion by communism , now dirty smearing of Wiki-leak reporter . What is next civilized action??. permalink quote 0 sam
fisher 6 September, 2010, 04:40	Never safe world,but maybe a new arms race.what about other intentions behinde this.Israel intends to attack Iran, they need help from mr Obama. So they intensify own positions.while they test Russian reaction. permalink quote 0 fisher
Vergil 25 January, 2012, 02:31	Well, why not put them in Iraq? Is Iraq gonna put them on trial for warCrimes? permalink quote 0 Vergil
Vergil 25 January, 2012, 02:33	CAnt the us put them in Cuba, G-bay? After all they are still on an embargo. permalink quote 0 Vergil
Slobodan 29 January, 2012, 15:58	The situation is that Russian dictator Putin will never ever let anyone to rule Russia until his death (like Stalin), therefore USA have to protect civilised world and build antimissiles in Europe protecting us from terrorists and Russian dictator. permalink quote -1 Slobodan
Rod M 29 March, 2012, 20:52	I support the idea of navy cruisers being equipped with anti-missile systems. Stationary anti-missile bases whether in Europe or Asia are more of a confidence boosting initative for insecure allies of the U.S. They make a good target for a sophisticated counter measure. I'm sure that Russia if motivated enough will not only develop counter measures and maybe a anti-missile system of their own....and why not. permalink quote 0 Rod M
Suzana 4 May, 2012, 06:03	I believe I may shed a little light on iron curtain behind power politics today. The common streotypes that Capitol Hill holds so close may stem from an even that took place in London long ago when someone was poisoned with radioactive substance. It smelled a lot like cold war politics at the time....which consequently got resumed by West....well...coughs it sure seems to me that way. I have no doubt Mr.Putin recognises this. I have no solution to this, I am after all a simple person not a political genius. The treat of Shield to Russia is quiite clear. Anyone can see it and military personel most of all. Its far more serious then public percieves it currently in NA who are kept in dark. If MR.Putin looks for support from American people he will ahve to find the way to first informed them about what is going on. Its going to be a time of great decisions for Mr.Putin, I am happy that Russia elected him again. He is the strenght and intelligence Russia needs. But after all he can not do it alone. I hope Russians remain wise and support him well. From Serbia with love permalink quote 0 Suzana
Richard (unregistered) 6 May, 2012, 21:05	USA and England want to encircle Russia and take hold of Russia's resources. The USA and England need to look after their own back garden first instead of trying to steal the wealth from other countries. England is pretty good at doing that as history will tell permalink quote 0 Richard (unregistered)
Richard (unregistered) 12 May, 2012, 19:42	Why don't the yanks put these exploding tubes on top of apartment buildings, amongst the civilian population, starting in England. Must be ok, the ENGLISH gvt says it's ok because they are doing it permalink quote 0 Richard (unregistered)
Andrew Robinson (unregistered) 13 May, 2012, 07:55	Just wondering. Is the Russian Radar base that RT are continuing to do stories on being built in Russia. Is it actually a HAARP instillation? The horrific ionospheric super weapon? Because that's kinda not cool......... permalink quote 0 Andrew Robinson (unregistered)

mike 18 August, 2008, 12:05

this is international corporations making a killing again, what purpose to plant missiles in poland i'm sure any sub or ship can be deployed with these missiles. cold war, just another fear tactic to spend more on both sides,, russia couldn't pawn of their equipment fast enough, now it wants to rearm please . that goes for the usa, why . because the military industrial complex wants to rape the citizens of the world. hmm,,,, usa, was pissed that russia was arming cuba,, i can understand why russia would be concerned with missiles in poland. iran my arse. total bullshit. on the other hand we usa/russia trade like nothing is going on. putin/bush greet each other like brothers at the olympics. what morons, but they laughing all the way to the bank.and the citizens are paying.

permalink quote mike

David 18 August, 2008, 18:02

Hi Robert; When USA posed this mad idea of placing missiles in the old USSR countries i.e. along Russia's border, Russia did approach USA to be part of the scheme - missiles against those fired from 'rogue states'. Russia offered the use of its tracking facilities whilst USA supplied the missiles. USA refused this offer from Russia. Refused this hand of friendship and continued co-operation. This refusal, by USA, has been a clear indication that, unless proven otherwise, the only 'rogue' country that USA is talking about is Russia. USA, using the cloak of NATO, is wanting to build a missile shield, against, Russia, for its purpose, on European soil. The USA has got no intention of creating a partnership with Russia to help build a safer world. Taking this a little further, Russia had complied with all requests made regarding the building of the Nuclar plant in Iran to prevent Iran from building 'the bomb'. And these requests (pressure) from the USA. The USA still thinks of Reds Under the Beds, and the Russians will your babies and all that clap trap. The media doesn't help any with their lies. If there was less hipocryts/liars as politicians I am sure we will live in a better world. Am sure you have heard of: There are lies, lies and statistics. Well you can politicians to the end of that statement.

permalink quote David

Eric 18 August, 2008, 23:22

Like most Americans, I have no idea what ten interceptor missles will accomplish against the vast array of ICBMs that Russia still has in its arsenel. I think the Bush administration ( reelected through the strategic plotting of Carl Rove -placing referendums on gay marriage on as many state ballots as possible- ) is rewarding Poland for playing along in Iraq. This is hardly any reward that I would appreciate. I hope that cooler heads prevail and all this foolish posturing stops.

permalink quote Eric

Pharago 19 August, 2008, 07:54

damn it, lets hope usa elections comes fast and the madman that lives in the white house gets kicked in his presidential ass for good, hes going to blow up european arms balance, missile shield? in poland? in poland? c'mon u've got to be kidding me, why not in israel? or egypt? or some place where it makes sense? anyone really belives that a missile flying from iran will cross the damn mediterranean sea? im telling you that man in the white house is an idiot that thinks that the rest of the world is as stupid as him, what a waste of resources.

permalink quote Pharago

panther 19 August, 2008, 10:34

The first post-Cold War expansion of NATO came with the reunification of Germany on 3 October 1990, when the former East Germany became part of the Federal Republic of Germany and the alliance. This had been agreed in the Two Plus Four Treaty earlier in the year. To secure Soviet approval of a united Germany remaining in NATO, it was agreed that foreign troops and nuclear weapons would not be stationed in the east. The scholar Stephen F. Cohen argued in 2005 that a commitment was given that NATO would never expand further east, but according to Robert B. Zoellick, then a State Department official involved in the Two Plus Four negotiating process, this appears to be a misperception; no formal commitment of the sort was made. On May 7, 2008, The Daily Telegraph held an interview with Gorbachev in which he repeated his view that such a commitment had been made. Gorbachev said "the Americans promised that NATO wouldn't move beyond the boundaries of Germany after the Cold War but now half of central and eastern Europe are members, so what happened to their promises? It shows they cannot be trusted." In April 2007, NATO's European allies called for a NATO missile defence system which would complement the American National Missile Defense system to protect Europe from missile attacks and NATO's decision-making. Russian president Vladimir Putin claimed that such a deployment could lead to a new arms race and could enhance the likelihood of mutual destruction. He also suggested that his country would freeze its compliance with the 1990 Treaty on Conventional Armed Forces in Europe (CFE)—which limits military deployments across the continent—until all NATO countries had ratified the adapted CFE treaty. NATO members wanted Russia to include a withdrawal of its forces in Georgia. The linkage between the ratification of the adapted treaty and the complete withdrawal has no legal basis, but is rather a political decision made by NATO members. After Russia was not willing to support the US missile defense plans in Europe, Putin threatened a "moratorium" on the treaty in his April 26, 2007 address. Putin later issued a decree intended to suspend the observance of its treaty obligations on July 14, 2007, effective 150 days later which means Russia is now entitled to enter into an "arms race". Russia's military spending last year was [ declared ] as $40 billion and it 'declared' a further [ $200 billion ] spending plan to "upgrade its armaments and military".

permalink quote panther

Arina 19 August, 2008, 10:45

Bob: Iran is bad now because they supply weapon to Terrorist? How about US gave all kind of money and weapon in 80's to Taliban and gave birth to Osama, US only gave all Chemcal weapon to Saddam to use against Iran, SO US only Harbor terrorist again Russia and Iran and now when Iran is doing same thing, US dont like it? Sure, so whatever US does is alway LEGAL and whatever the rest of the world does is always Illegal? Talk about INVADING Iran, (We the USA should just do it ourself, and Invade Iran) Yeah sure, GO TRY IT, or first Finish your Iraq and Afghanistan Invasion then try Iran or you would never end it in 50 years (unlike Iraq and Afghanistan is going on 8th year now) 50 years or more will take to Invade Iran, just like Israel trying Palestine for 60 years now. Now invasion is the defination what you mean by Invade, unlike Stupid bush said "Mission Accounplished" STILL NOT YET.

permalink quote Arina

Walter 19 August, 2008, 19:42

The Russian concern over anti missile bases in Poland for the defense of Europe against possible attacks from missiles fired from the middle East is totally unfounded. The scope of this missile is hardly large enough to protect Europe from the large number of Russian missiles still targeted on the West. It seems to me that Comrade Putin has once again succumbed to the centuries old Russian paranoia of the west has returned to the world stage. Now that he has the financial backing from the sale of oil and gas I think we will see him try to re-erect the Iron Curtain and pull as many of the former Republics in with him. With this in mind, the placement of US anti-missiles will be an absolute necessity and unfortunately lead to a renewal of the arms race.

permalink quote Walter

Neutral 19 August, 2008, 20:40

What are the range of these so called rogue state's missiles?Why is the proposed missile defence shield nescessary in Poland or is that relevant to the trajectory nescessary for interception? We all know the only real winners in any arms race is the guy who runs the production line but that's nothing new. The funny thing is that if you locked some honest level headed openminded forward thinking US citizens into the same building with some similiarly minded Russian citizens and left them there for a whole day they would probably exit that very room as the best of friends whereas if you locked just a group of Polish citizens into that building on their own they would probably start fighting with each other. The thing is the ordinary man on the street who has any reasonable intellect or wisdom on world matters knows damn well that it's mainly a race to secure resources and stability in the regions these resources come from and the dice has already been thrown. Back to the missile defence shield.It won't work without Russian cooperation.Let's be reasonable.would you allow it on your borders without proper consultation and cooperation.After all it would surely be passing over your airspace to hit these rouge state's missiles eh?? We need to stop the monopoly mentality and realise that EVERYONE on this earth needs a safe free clean earth and spend a little more time regulating the private corporations who are profiting from our planet's resources and its inhabitants quarrels.

permalink quote Neutral

tlumacz 21 August, 2008, 10:07

The recent decision of Polish authorities to allow placing U.S. antimissiles in Poland is highly unpopular. It is against public opinion. Therefore, a spontanous demonstration SOLIDARITY WITH RUSSIA has been scheduled in front of of Russian Embassy in Poland, Warsaw, 49 Belwederska Street, on Friday, August 22nd, at 5 p.m. Polish time.

permalink quote tlumacz

sam 25 August, 2010, 23:06

17 August, 2008, 14:07, Dolly wrote > yes the same Alqeida that the Americans created and funded. Saddam Hussein used to be a CIA agent. I don't think America are in a position to give morality lessons. They are tyrants, who support the brutal Zionist government of Israel. Well done Russia for not letting America walk all over you; I couldn't explain better, as they did similarly toppling Iranian Democratic government ( Dr Mossadeg ) , then toppled the Late Shah, creating so called green Band as Islam , to prevent oil rich Middle-East , of invasion by communism , now dirty smearing of Wiki-leak reporter . What is next civilized action??.

permalink quote sam

fisher 6 September, 2010, 04:40

Never safe world,but maybe a new arms race.what about other intentions behinde this.Israel intends to attack Iran, they need help from mr Obama. So they intensify own positions.while they test Russian reaction.

permalink quote fisher

Vergil 25 January, 2012, 02:31

Well, why not put them in Iraq? Is Iraq gonna put them on trial for warCrimes?

permalink quote Vergil

Vergil 25 January, 2012, 02:33

CAnt the us put them in Cuba, G-bay? After all they are still on an embargo.

permalink quote Vergil

Slobodan 29 January, 2012, 15:58

The situation is that Russian dictator Putin will never ever let anyone to rule Russia until his death (like Stalin), therefore USA have to protect civilised world and build antimissiles in Europe protecting us from terrorists and Russian dictator.

permalink quote Slobodan

Rod M 29 March, 2012, 20:52

I support the idea of navy cruisers being equipped with anti-missile systems. Stationary anti-missile bases whether in Europe or Asia are more of a confidence boosting initative for insecure allies of the U.S. They make a good target for a sophisticated counter measure. I'm sure that Russia if motivated enough will not only develop counter measures and maybe a anti-missile system of their own....and why not.

permalink quote Rod M

Suzana 4 May, 2012, 06:03

I believe I may shed a little light on iron curtain behind power politics today. The common streotypes that Capitol Hill holds so close may stem from an even that took place in London long ago when someone was poisoned with radioactive substance. It smelled a lot like cold war politics at the time....which consequently got resumed by West....well...coughs it sure seems to me that way. I have no doubt Mr.Putin recognises this. I have no solution to this, I am after all a simple person not a political genius. The treat of Shield to Russia is quiite clear. Anyone can see it and military personel most of all. Its far more serious then public percieves it currently in NA who are kept in dark. If MR.Putin looks for support from American people he will ahve to find the way to first informed them about what is going on. Its going to be a time of great decisions for Mr.Putin, I am happy that Russia elected him again. He is the strenght and intelligence Russia needs. But after all he can not do it alone. I hope Russians remain wise and support him well. From Serbia with love

permalink quote Suzana

Richard (unregistered) 6 May, 2012, 21:05

USA and England want to encircle Russia and take hold of Russia's resources. The USA and England need to look after their own back garden first instead of trying to steal the wealth from other countries. England is pretty good at doing that as history will tell

permalink quote Richard (unregistered)

Richard (unregistered) 12 May, 2012, 19:42

Why don't the yanks put these exploding tubes on top of apartment buildings, amongst the civilian population, starting in England. Must be ok, the ENGLISH gvt says it's ok because they are doing it

permalink quote Richard (unregistered)

Andrew Robinson (unregistered) 13 May, 2012, 07:55

Just wondering. Is the Russian Radar base that RT are continuing to do stories on being built in Russia. Is it actually a HAARP instillation? The horrific ionospheric super weapon?

Because that's kinda not cool.........

permalink quote Andrew Robinson (unregistered)

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