Copycat weapons a threat to Russia's economic security
Published: 09 February, 2010, 18:58
Edited: 16 September, 2010, 03:45
Pirate production is among the key problems of the global weapons market. Superpowers that used to help their allies establish their own defense industries during the Cold War now face the consequences of that help.
These practices suit Russia because through Chinese link Russian allies are being armed for which US and Israel will have strong objections if Russia did it directly. Russia wouldn’t have earned much money from S-300 missiles deal with Iran but has gained a lot by Iran acquiring this weapon on its own to repel potential Israeli aggression. This pragmatic approach gives Russia an advantage over its adversary for a tic-tac response action which most of the time exceeds immediate profit.
@ali Dear sir, this is one of the biggest nonsenses I've heard in years! You definitely must try to work in politics cause you have talent! Put perhaps few Latin or French words in text sometime that will make it look even better. If you don't speak French doesn't matter make them sound French.... Thank for sharing your wisdom. What would this world become without you............
Jako777 I can see that you are easily irritated if you read others not sharing your opinion. In my post I gave facts why is it in Russian favour Iranians acquiring defensive capability to repel any Israeli aggression without Russians involvement. Russia has a significant geopolitical and economic interest with Iranian friendship and if it can be sustained without aggravating its international image with its adversaries, whom are doing everything to get a foothold on Iranians natural resources, it would be to Russia’s advantage, wouldn’t it? Mind you, Russia is not stupid to sell its state of the art cutting edge military achievements to foreigners which keep Russia at a comfortable advantage over the rest of the World, including USA. Jako777, why don’t you tell us in your opinion with facts why my comment is wrong, instead of whinging about it?
This article is wrong - Poland has a valid license to produce T-72 and its variants.
China copies anything, that`s not news. But then again many world governments (including the Russian one) jump up every time China sais so. Irony? The article started with historical examples of Germans making copies of BM launcher and the T-34 tank. This however is an excellent example of soviet era slander: the development and the main principle of operation of the BM "katyusha" rocket carrying truck and the German "Nebelwerfer" are completely different. Katyusha used aerodynamically stabilized projectiles lauched from guide rails, which were mounted on a truck. German Nebelwerfer used spin-stabilized rockets (and such principle is the most widely used today) launched from tubes which were either towed, or mounted on halftracks. The T-34 was an evolutionary development of the BT-7 light tank, and BT-7 was a copy of the US-made "Christie" tank which USSR bought a copy of. Panther (Pzkw-5) development started in early 30`s. T-34 uses Christie torsion bar suspension, cast turret located in front with driver`s hatch as a part of the frontal armor, 76-mm or 85-mm gun, a rear mounted V-2 diesel engine and a rear sprocket drive, gross weight around 30 tons depending on model. Panther: multi-wheel suspension superior in performance to T-34, welded turret and hull (much taller than T-34) with turret located in the middle and driver`s hatch on top of the hull, 75-mm high velocity gun which was never surpassed by similar soviet guns, rear mounted petrol engine with gearbox and driving sprockets forward, gross weigh 45 tons and much thicker armor than T-34. So RT, what similarities, or what copies are we talking about? Germans unlike Chinese always had original innovative ideas which everybody copies.
For perfect example take AK-47 (7,62 x 39 mm) and AK-74 (5,45 x 39 mm) automatic assault riffles. Millions and millions copies of original russian made AK-47 and AK-74 riffles are made daily world wide... And they do not have the licence from IZHMASH company to produce them ! Kalashnikov invented AK-47 by himself...and the ----- say that he stole the blueprints from german StG-44 and MP-43... But AK-47 has completely different mechanisms, parts and design inside than German made StG-44 or MP-43 !!!!
The classic example of a copycat weapon is the Soviet Tupelov bomber, TU-4, which was reversed engineered from three US B-29s that landed in Siberia during the late days of WW II.
I find it somewhat ironic, that with the callapes of the Soviet Union - almost every former Soviet country capitalized on the sale of everything and anything which was military to anyone who wanted to pay hard currency. Russia likewise has been willing to sell even more advanced weapon systems to whom ever - even though up until recently they have not been able to aford it themselves! The former Soviet Union stopped selling military equipment to the PRC, when they had their Communist ideology conflict in the late 1960's. It was a then releaf to the Soviet weapons manufactureswho were concerned about Chinese un-licenced copying then! During the Viet Nam War the Soviet's were more than aware that by passing their advanced weapons systems (S-75 / SA-2 'Guidline' SAM's) via the shortest and quickest route to North Viet Nam - that the PRC were and did scim the cream off the top! The PRC was helping themselves to the latest Soviet weaponary both pysicaly and technologicly! And yet knowing China's world wide reputation for allegal copying they chose to sell the PRC the likes of their state-of-the-art weapons systems of S-300 SAM, Kilo Class submarines, Su-27 Flankers, IL-76 strategic transport aircraft, Il-78 tankers, Sovremenny-class destroyers and their powerful and advanced SS-N-22 SUNBURN SSM's and SA-N-7 'Gadfly' SAM system. It should be remembered also that before the callaps of the Soviet Union and the economic boom of the PRC, the most numeical fighter aircraft of the PLAAF was the obserlete copied MiG-19 (Shenyang J-6) and that China was seen by the Soviets as one of thier greatest unprodictable threat! Realy what did the Russian think the PRC was going to do with the influx and avalability of some of the worlds most advanced and powerful weapons systems the world had seen!!!!! One only needs to read Sun Tzu 'Art of War, which the PLA still follow to the letter!! Funny thing is the Soviet were ment to have followed it also!! Willy
It is not possible for Tehran to develop a air defense system equivalent to or superior to the S-300, without foreign assistance, the batteries that Tehran order were not enough to secure all their current military and nuclear infrastructure, as such the plan was always to clone the Russian system and create and indigenous model of the S-300. The problem is that once Iran has sufficient quantities of the indigenous S-300, most likely a clone of the HQ-9 they will be supplied to Syria and to Hizbullah in Iran. Israel know that Iran will do this two it prevents Israel incursions into Lebanon and Syria but it also provides a first ring of air defense security for Tehran against Israel. Lebanon/LAF will welcome the Iranian gift to Hizbullah. As always it is not about Syria, Hizbullah it is about the Persian superpower this deliver of the Iranian HQ-9/S-300 clone gives Iran the ability to intercept the first strike of the Jericho, and the second strike of the capability of nuclear armed F-16's, far from Tehran, leaving Israel will a first strike capability from the Dolphin. Iran fires its nukes Israel responds or vice versa and the Israeli BM are intercepted over Israel. That is why Iran says it will run Israel into the sea and Assad says that the Israeli bomb cannot protect them. Make room in Russia the immigrants maybe returning to Russia if the Iranians have their way.
I think Israel will adopt the new Russian nuclear doctrine in regards to threats, as such the current situation and future implications dictates, I can see no other option left to the Israeli's other than pre-emptive nuclear action. That is my professional opinion, otherwise they will be run into the sea, if they wish to live as a state and a free people they have no other choice.
Look the S-300 or the HQ-9/S-300 clone does not concern me personally, the Harpy-2 will overwhelm the system with the new UAV's higher altitude and then the F-16's entering the airspace to nullify the air defense, sector after sector before the second waves enters the airspace of the sectors. What the Jews do have that you will not find published in print is UUV's remoras which attach to the hull of the Dolphin and can be used as a stand alone platform controlled from land bases, these units hunt in wolf packs and fire torpedo's. Now if Israel gave such defense equipment to Georgia that would have huge strategic implication on the Black Sea Fleet and the New French LHD's. That would allow Georgia to box in reinforcements the Black Sea Fleet in Odessa, block Bosporus and target the forces close to the Georgian coast and the supply of logistics to Abkahazia, train the Georgian in underwater SF operations such as placing limpets on the Black Sea Fleet vessels. Second Israel could help Georgia build its first nuclear reactor and be supplied with an export version mobile missile launcher of Jericho 3, none of which will happen. But they could if they wanted too. What Russia have to ask yourselves is why did the Iranians want a former FBI expert Robert Levinson on Russian organized crime and thus also Chechen bandits, since his disappearance in 2007 there has been an uptick in Islamic violence in the Caucasus .
@jacko you state Russia is not stupid to sell its state of the art cutting edge military achievements to foreigners which keep Russia at a comfortable advantage over the rest of the World, including USA. This is funny lmfao!!! Russia cannot afford its own weapons they export them to anyone with money. Russian bombers are 60 years old and the the Navy is rusting away!!! The s-300 is a good system but no better then the Patriot system. The only deterent Russia has is a Nuclear one. There conventional army is worthless as seen by the war in Georgia The Russians and the Russian people should focus on regaining political freedoms and diversifying there economy instead of trying to regain the glory days Understand this Russia is not a superpower. I'm sorry
Jako777 I have the answer is simple Russia will have to find customers that do not stealing the technology or borrow and improve as they like to call it. As can be seen with the Mistral still to be worked out, UAV's from Israel. As we all move on from the cold war, Russia will find other markets for equipment that do not steal technology. The old cold war doctrine of not procuring Russia equipment will fade away into the past. Part of that is that new NATO countries use Russia type equipment. So in the longer run Russia will produce better equipment for export, find new customers that respect commercial agreements and those that have stolen, borrowed technology. Will lose out in the longer term and it will not affect the Russians fiscally. It will take some time but that is what will occur, you can see the start of that occurring now and it will only continue into the future.
I should had that while this about the copying of Russian military equipment, and the PRC will cut into the Russian export market, it is also the doctrine in regards to non-military commercial exports, the high speed super trains also are "borrowed and improved technology" from Western Europe, so the PRC will also cut into the French market by undercutting their exports for super trains in the future. The French are not happy about that matter. On the HQ-9 I would have done the same thing to secure my energy security, to counter an Israel strike, that is why the PRC was not concerned by the unofficial and official advice from the US to support sanctions and secure alternate energy supply, due to the risk of an Israeli strike. It was in the PRC national security interest to supply the technological transfer of the HQ-9 to Iran.
1mike, The American B-52 bombers are just as old as the Tu-95 Bears. The USAF intends to keep them at least for another 30 years, possibly until they are 100 years old. The Russians intend to do the same thing. The Russian Navy has been undergoing a major re-haul in recent years, with the Black Sea fleet being the only one still suffering, due to higher priorities in other fleets. Georgia lost the invasion of South Ossetia in 2008 with a small fraction of the Russian army in theatre, so I fail to see how worthless they really were. The S-300 remains significantly superior to that of the Patriot. Russia isn't focusing exclusively on a larger military, and is spending far more money on developing its economy. Rather, it is the US that is spending such massive sums of money on its military, and the cracks are showing as a result. Russia knows and admits that it's not a military superpower. It is, however, a major power, and that it knows. I suggest you ease off the anti-Russian propaganda; it makes you sound like a neocon fool.
Goran, FYI: The B-52s may be old by design, but inside them are state-of-the-art avionics and new equipment including engines, as part of the periodic updates the US been doing for years. As they said: "It's not your grandfather's B-52 anymore." Besides the highly versatile B-52s the US also has a large fleet of B-1 bombers and of course the B-2 stealth bombers. Off-topic aside, it's undeniable that Russia did itself a disservice by selling high-end weapons to a well-known copycat. Someday, that may come back an haunts you if God-forbid the Chinese decided to fight for control of Russian territory in the southeast.
To all who have commented, it would be wise to realise that the USA and the UK are powers in decline...the world is changing fast and we need to work with countries like Russia...and others who are willing, to ensure our safe future. I am native British and loyal to my country.....but we need a new and much wider alliance.
Why not give Iranian's S-400, it is a defensive missiles and Israel and USA are preparing an aggression against IRAN. American has supplied weaponry as well as anti-aircraft missiles when Soviets were fighting Muslim terrorist like USA is doing now. Give them back a little what they have given you in the past and call it even.
The T-34 was never the first tank with sloped armor, and the T-34 itself is based on the BT tank, which is an almost carbon copy of the american Christie tank. German Panther was not only a 100% original and futuristic design, it was the grandfather of all MBTs and outclassed the T-34 in every respect, except reliability, ease of manufacture and price. This is as the previous comment said old soviet propaganda, but who gives a damn, right? Fact is that the USSR did in fact have hundreds upon thousands of completely original concepts in both armored vehicles, aircraft, ships, small arms etc... but either these creations never saw the light of day because their authors were executed or sent to Siberia during Stalin's purges, or they did make it like the famous fighter I-16 aircraft - but in that case, as was with many other great designs of its time, it came out of the "sharashka" (makeshift design bureau inside the Gulag) from the mind of some poor imprisoned scientist or engineer. So to cover up for that as well as the USSR's own "concept theft" came the myth of something being copied by the west, even the Germans during ww2. In fact, they did have a proposal to copy the T-34, but it was never done for a wide range of reasons, so all the way from the Panther to the Tiger II, from the Bf-109 to the Me-262, from the simple and cheap V1 to the expensive first ever space rocket A4 Germans always had their own, sometimes flawed but always original ideas. As with China: they never had anything original except Chinese food. They make copies of everything, including copies of copy machines for office use. They have neither imagination or the common decency to hold true to any license for production, nor international patents... and when they need something they just take something and copy it. That all thanks to USSR helping communism come to power there.










GREAT subject thanks! Missed completely to understand part called "The solution" ....there wasn't any....... There was no "solution" or even attempt to answer question what can Russia do to stop that?! WHY did Russia wait so long???! WHY ???! How are you going to stop the Chinese now when they even mastered to MIX the copies? Everything about that country reminds me on cheap COPY! I imagine that even their president is clone!